Ender's Game and related series

[freelantzer]

Originally Posted by DeathlyH

I'm looking forward to reading the last book in the Shadow series, Shadow of the Giant. Just from the title it sounds interesting, because during Ender's Game I always loved reading about the fantasy game with the giant. It was just so creepy, in a cool way!

Oh, I haven't read it yet, but I thought Shadow of the Giant referred to Bean himself, since he keeps growing.

Originally Posted by chparadise

Anyways, I liked both tetrads, though the Shadow Series was better I think. I guess I liked the more personal aspect to Bean as opposed to Ender, who wasn't as likable in subsequent books to me as he was in the first.

You know, Ender has always reminded me of Buffy's Angel, in a way. How they are both so tortured by what they have done in their pasts, and their quests for redemption. I always loved that about Ender. But you're right, Ender is not the same character in his sequels that I fell in love with in Ender's Game. He's torn apart by the events of that book, and I can't understand some of the choices he makes in the rest of the series.

[Caliope]

I lost interest in this saga midway through the Shadow series. 'Xenocide' is my absolute fave of the bunch - I love the plot with Qing-Jao and her obsessive wood-grain tracing - but for some reason I wasn't that interested in Bean and his backstory. It's all incredibly well-written of course, but I'm more partial to the Ender series.

[freelantzer]

Originally Posted by Caliope

'Xenocide' is my absolute fave of the bunch - I love the plot with Qing-Jao and her obsessive wood-grain tracing.

I was so mad when I started reading Xenocide and every other chapter was devoted to Qing-Jao! That ment less time with Ender! We already gave up some Ender time in Speaker for the Dead with the piggies plot (which I wasn't too thrilled about at the beginning of Speaker). But Card is such a fantastic writer, that he just keeps sucking me in! As I read, I became invested in all these new characters and their worlds even though I was determined not to like them at the beginning of the books. That's just great writing!

[Caliope]

hahaha - honestly, as Ender grew up, I became less and less interested in him as a character. I know that sounds disloyal, because I still cared about what was going to happen to him later. But it was like, once he wrote The Hive Queen and The Hegemon, there was this whole other universe to explore, with Ender's personal story being a much smaller focal point to go back to.

Don't get me wrong - I still loved Ender. But after the first book, I think it was important to get away from his perspective and tell the story from different points of view.

Spoiler: show

Such as the moment when the group finally goes to parley with The Hive Queen - that scene was so strange and frightening, but wouldn't have been if Card had chosen to tell it from Ender's perspective instead of Valentine's. She has that deep-seated terror from watching all the war vids back on Earth, so that gives the scene an edge that would have been missing if he'd told the scene from the POV of a character who's already sympathetic to the Hive Queen.

Also, the Qing-Jao story was more than likely the starting point of my long-standing fascination with Asian culture. (Sorry, I'm babbling - I haven't ever, ever gotten a chance to 'forum' about these books before.)

[freelantzer]

Originally Posted by Caliope

hahaha - honestly, as Ender grew up, I became less and less interested in him as a character. I know that sounds disloyal, because I still cared about what was going to happen to him later. But it was like, once he wrote The Hive Queen and The Hegemon, there was this whole other universe to explore, with Ender's personal story being a much smaller focal point to go back to.

Ender did become less interesting in subsequent books. I'm not sure why that is. If it's because Card chose to focus less on his personal journey, or his personal journey was just less interesting than all the other storylines going on. I don't know . . . it's been a while since I read these books.

But I did see an article today about Ender's Game in Entertainment Weekly. Apparently Ender's Game is going to be released as a comic-book adaptation in October of this year. Card will be signing autographs at Comic-Con.

[YellowPoofBall]

I really enjoyed Ender's Game. I was so attached to Ender that I didn't like when the story diverged to other perspectives, like Valentine and Peter's, but they always came back and related to Ender's story, so it's okay. I think I'll start Ender's Shadow next, unless I can get Speaker for the Dead first. I read on wiki I think it was that Card wrote Ender's Game as a prologue to Speaker for the Dead, so I hope it's as captivating. I'm just not sure if I'll like middle-aged Ender as much, because little boy Ender was so endearing.

[Caliope]

You know, I hadn't thought about it before, but I think that's part of the reason I became less interested as the series went on. Because the little boy Ender was so easy to empathise with and adore, and as he gets older, he becomes more jaded and nihilistic. It's depressing, y'know? That's why I started latching onto other characters.

Speaking of which, Miro is awesome. I was horrified at what happened to him at the end of Speaker for the Dead - took me a long time to forgive Orson Scott Card for that one.

[RemusLupinFan]

I just finished reading Ender's Game this morning. I thought it was great, and the twist was excellent. The psychological aspect of the book was very intriguing and always kept me guessing. I thought Peter was really creepy, and I was afraid he was really going to kill Ender and/or Valentine at one point. The Giant's Drink fantasy game was also creepy, the way it showed Ender Peter's face. And also the buggers - I really liked the ending. I'm not sure if I'll end up reading the sequels quite yet, but I'll keep them in the back of my mind for future reading.

[Rhea7]

After reading Enders game, which i absolutely loved, I went the other way then most the poster on this thread and read Ender's Shadow and Shadow of the Hegemon, which were told in Bean's perspective. Those two have some extra, realy cool sci-fi stuff in there, mostly revolving around DNA (I won't say much more because I don't want to spoil it for anyone). I attempted to read Speaker for the Dead but I couldn't get through it and just stopped for my assigned reading and never got back to it. Does it pick up as the book goes on?

[YellowPoofBall]

I thought Speaker for the Dead did pick up after a while. It seemed to drag a little in the beginning to me too but I found the book to be a good read overall.

I just finished Ender's Shadow and Shadow of the Hegemon too. They were both great. Ender's Game is still my favorite book of the series but Shadow of the Hegemon runs a close second. I liked Ender's Shadow but I spent too much time wondering what Ender was doing throughout the book. I haven't been able to get through Xenocide yet but I think I'm going to try that one again next.

[RemusLupinFan]

Originally Posted by Rhea7

Those two have some extra, realy cool sci-fi stuff in there, mostly revolving around DNA (I won't say much more because I don't want to spoil it for anyone).

Ooh that sounds quite interesting. In that case, I may pick up a copy of those books. Also, I'm very curious to know if Ender ever gets to communicate with the queen he finds a home for in the end of Ender's Game. Does Speaker for the Dead pick up with Ender's point of view again?

[freelantzer]

Originally Posted by RemusLupinFan

Ooh that sounds quite interesting. In that case, I may pick up a copy of those books. Also, I'm very curious to know if Ender ever gets to communicate with the queen he finds a home for in the end of Ender's Game. Does Speaker for the Dead pick up with Ender's point of view again?

Yes, Speaker for the Dead follows Ender's story and will answer your question.

[Caliope]

Rhea: Speaker for the Dead was the slowest-paced and, for me, least enjoyable book of the series, but it does pick up, and it is worthwhile to carry it through I think. There's a lot of awesome to had in Lusitania, and you get to meet 'Jane'!

[haiya227]

My favourite is Ender's Game. I really liked the strategies and the emotional aspects of this novel.

[HMN]

Originally Posted by RemusLupinFan

I just finished reading Ender's Game this morning. I thought it was great, and the twist was excellent. The psychological aspect of the book was very intriguing and always kept me guessing. I thought Peter was really creepy, and I was afraid he was really going to kill Ender and/or Valentine at one point. The Giant's Drink fantasy game was also creepy, the way it showed Ender Peter's face. And also the buggers - I really liked the ending. I'm not sure if I'll end up reading the sequels quite yet, but I'll keep them in the back of my mind for future reading.

I just finished the book yesterday and I can't get it out of my head. It was written about 30 years ago, but it's still so relevant. Just the general theme of power, how it's created, who uses it...

I had anticipated what the simulator battles were because of a comment after the first few from Mazer, but I didn't expect the Giant's Drink mind game to have any additional meaning. At the beginning of the book, I didn't expect the buggers to be real, I thought they were going to use the kids for something even more sinister, but I was glad to see they were somewhat honest about who the 'enemy' was.

I don't think I'll read more of the series, but very glad to have read this one. So question - what age range do you think the book is geared for?

[Spacecadet]

Ender's game is my all time favorite book. I fell in love with it from the moment i read it! I love the twist at the end, i never saw it coming and i enjoyed the battle school scene and all the really smart kids.

For anyone looking for more into ender's realm I have read the full series. ender's shadow is a great read if you like parallel novels from another perspective, i thought writing from beans perspective was really interesting. That whole "shadow" series i enjoyed immensely but it did get very political at times with peter and some of the other battle school grads, but it is good to see he outgrows his fierce mean streak.


The back trilogy, is all ender and valentine, and its very late 80's scifi esq. I enjoyed them but not nearly as much as the shadow series. But it is good to see how ender continued on his path. I did find them hard to jump into because the first bit of the series doesnt start with ender.

The stand alone in my opinion is ender in exile, it does tie enders game to speaker for the dead. This book i would actually recommend reading last as if you have read all the others you will see hints of things from the other books. It was interesting to see how ender spent his time on the way to the planet he begins on in speaker, but it wasnt my favorite book either. I did enjoy being back in ender's world after so long, and i did also really like the insight into his mind and how he thinks and outsmarts others.

Originally Posted by HMN

I don't think I'll read more of the series, but very glad to have read this one. So question - what age range do you think the book is geared for?

I read it for the first time at 15 or 16 and thought it was appropriate for me at the time, however i always had a slightly below average reading level growing up. I would definitely classify it as YA even though it didnt really exist when this book was written. The standard rule is the age range for the book is usually geared at the age of the main character in the story, but this is not a hard fast rule and probably isnt the case because this was written before ya really existed like it does today, and also taking into account that the main character is a child genius. So that in mind depending on the reader id say 12-13 is probably the youngest if they are an advanced reader. But im certainly not an expert there.

[RemusLupinFan]

I've just finished re-reading Ender's Game and have started reading Speaker for the Dead. Before starting the actual book, I read the introduction by the author, which was very interesting because it provided insights on Card's writing process. So far, I'm liking the book (though perhaps not quite as much as Ender's Game).

Spoiler: show

It was interesting how Ender (and Valentine) was still alive after 3000 years by traveling though space for so long. But it's almost like he isn't allowed to die until he performs his task of finding a home for the queen of the buggers, which is looking like it might be Lusitania at this point. I like how she can communicate with him - I guess once she was able to access his mind through the ansible that first time, she was forever able to communicate with him. I was thinking a similar thing might happen in the future - that the buggers when they awaken may be able to broadcast their hopes for peace using the ansibles. But since there's another few books left in the series, I figure the buggers may not be very prominent in this story.

Jane is very interesting - I understand her to be a sentience within the computer/ansible system that was accidentally born. I'm thinking this story may not have her being discovered by the rest of mankind, but a future one may.

Lastly, the pequeninos are quite interesting. I am dying to know what it was that Pipo discovered just before he was killed. For some reason, I am beginning to think that the killings are related to their reproduction cycle - like they are removing an internal reproductive organ or something.

After I finish Speaker, I am very likely to pick up the next book in this series (which is Xenocide, I believe).

[Spacecadet]

Originally Posted by RemusLupinFan

After I finish Speaker, I am very likely to pick up the next book in this series (which is Xenocide, I believe).

yes xenocide is next then children of the mind.

Jane is a really interesting character in the series.

If you like the back end of the series i recommend you read ender in exile as well. The Ender's shadow series is also really good. There's also some short stories related to the series that are pretty good as well.

[freelantzer]

Originally Posted by Spacecadet

ender in exile

I read Speaker, Xenocide, and Children of the Mind, but I've never read that one. What's that one about and when does it take place?

[Spacecadet]

Ender in exile takes place between ender's game and speaker for the dead. It's about ender and valentine's journey to lusitania. Its really interesting cause you can really see how ender thinks through and manipulates things so they end up the way they are supposed to. i think you get the most out of it if you read it after having read all the others.