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Good and Evil: how do people become either way?



 
 
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  #41  
Old July 1st, 2010, 2:16 pm
Midnightsfire  Undisclosed.gif Midnightsfire is offline
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Re: Good and Evil: how do people become either way?

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Originally Posted by Wab View Post
Except the existence of evil (for want of a better term) is not the topic of the thread; it's how do people become "evil".
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Originally Posted by Wab View Post
It's neither because no one is either good or evil, they're just people with qualities good and bad.
Sounds like denial to me.


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  #42  
Old July 1st, 2010, 7:40 pm
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Re: Good and Evil: how do people become either way?

Nope. Merely a mature acknowledgement that we are beings with free will rather than somehow pre-programmed automatons. Actually believing that a human is inherently one way or another is the true act of denial and abrogation of responsibility.


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  #43  
Old July 1st, 2010, 11:05 pm
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Re: Good and Evil: how do people become either way?

*walks in thread and shakes head*

@ Midnightsfire: It's not that people are naive persay, it's that they all share different opinions on the subject at hand. No one is right or wrong overall here.


@ lightreading: Definitely true there. There can be the people who mistreat their pets, the ones who treat others badly, etc... and so on and so forth. Same thing with good as well.

But evil in general -- like you said, it's about the act itself. There are some acts that cross the line there in terms of being evil overall, like murder. And there are some, like bullying another person, that while being evil still -- aren't anywhere near the point of pure evil.


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  #44  
Old July 15th, 2010, 7:39 am
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Re: Good and Evil: how do people become either way?

It's a combination of both.

I know kids that barely know their fathers, but they act almost exactly like them.


  #45  
Old July 15th, 2010, 10:53 pm
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Re: Good and Evil: how do people become either way?

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It's a combination of both.

I know kids that barely know their fathers, but they act almost exactly like them.
You bring up a good point, KetchupRevenge.

I never really knew my own father... but there are times when I do act like him... and I don't really like it.

Children never really know (at least for the most part) what they'll be like until they get old enough. That's when their true nature begins to show more plainly.


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  #46  
Old July 16th, 2010, 12:35 am
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Re: Good and Evil: how do people become either way?

Lets not forget that free will does have a part.

One chooses his/her actions.


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---Eddie Scrap-Iron Dupris (Million Dollar Baby)
  #47  
Old July 16th, 2010, 12:38 am
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Re: Good and Evil: how do people become either way?

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Originally Posted by Midnightsfire View Post
Lets not forget that free will does have a part.

One chooses his/her actions.
I don't tend to forget that. I tend to think in some ways there's a balance there between the whole it's part of your nature thing and one tending to choose his/her actions.


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  #48  
Old July 25th, 2010, 2:47 pm
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Re: Good and Evil: how do people become either way?

I think that one's childhood can influence a person's character and personality. Although, I do believe that some people are just destined to be, and born evil.


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  #49  
Old July 25th, 2010, 11:21 pm
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Re: Good and Evil: how do people become either way?

There is no good and evil, only power and those too weak to seek it.


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  #50  
Old July 26th, 2010, 12:16 am
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Re: Good and Evil: how do people become either way?

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Originally Posted by MuggleGirl09 View Post
I think that one's childhood can influence a person's character and personality. Although, I do believe that some people are just destined to be, and born evil.
And so can't be held responsible for their actions.


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  #51  
Old July 26th, 2010, 12:40 am
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Re: Good and Evil: how do people become either way?

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Originally Posted by MuggleGirl09 View Post
I think that one's childhood can influence a person's character and personality. Although, I do believe that some people are just destined to be, and born evil.
I would qualify this by stating that a person is at times born predisposed to their fellow man (and perhaps life in general) that is decidedly destructive, anti-social and just wrong.

Having said predisposition doesn't preclude free-will.

For example, I was born with a predisposition for a quick temper. (My father's). I have learned to control it oh so long ago.
(Unless my pc starts acting up.."aww...geez! Not again!"


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All fighters are pig-headed some way or another: some part of them always thinks they know better than you about something. Truth is: even if they're wrong, even if that one thing is going to be the ruin of them, if you can beat that last bad out of them... they ain't fighters at all.

---Eddie Scrap-Iron Dupris (Million Dollar Baby)
  #52  
Old July 26th, 2010, 12:45 pm
MuggleGirl09  Female.gif MuggleGirl09 is offline
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Re: Good and Evil: how do people become either way?

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Originally Posted by Midnightsfire View Post
I would qualify this by stating that a person is at times born predisposed to their fellow man (and perhaps life in general) that is decidedly destructive, anti-social and just wrong.

Having said predisposition doesn't preclude free-will.

For example, I was born with a predisposition for a quick temper. (My father's). I have learned to control it oh so long ago.
(Unless my pc starts acting up.."aww...geez! Not again!"
Thank you for stating this. A person doesn't have to follow what they were destined for. It's the person's choice to turn it and make it something good, make their life good. However, there are those people that just don't want to, are still destined for doing evil things, and to only bring harm to others, as well as their selves.

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Originally Posted by Wab View Post
And so can't be held responsible for their actions.
Technically, the person is held responsible for their own actions. It's a reason why they might do bad and evil things, but not an excuse. If a person born evil goes out and kills another human being, they are still held responsible for what they have done, not anyone else.


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What matters is the part we choose to act on.
That's who we really are." -Sirius Black
  #53  
Old July 26th, 2010, 1:36 pm
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Re: Good and Evil: how do people become either way?

But if, as you say, they are born evil you can no more blame them than you can blame a person for having blue eyes.

If you cite such simplistic rot as destiny learn the definition: "the predetermined, usually inevitable or irresistible, course of events."

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/destiny


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A patriot is someone who wants the best for his country, including the best laws and the best ideals. It's something other people should call you -- you shouldn't call yourself that. People who call themselves patriots are usually liars. -- Donald Woods

You got what anybody gets . . . You got a lifetime. -- Death of the Endless
  #54  
Old July 26th, 2010, 1:40 pm
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Re: Good and Evil: how do people become either way?

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Originally Posted by Wab View Post
But if, as you say, they are born evil you can no more blame them than you can blame a person for having blue eyes.

If you cite such simplistic rot as destiny learn the definition: "the predetermined, usually inevitable or irresistible, course of events."

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/destiny
I see your point of view, but having blue eyes and being born evil are two completely different things.


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  #55  
Old July 26th, 2010, 7:18 pm
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Re: Good and Evil: how do people become either way?

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Originally Posted by MuggleGirl09 View Post
Thank you for stating this. A person doesn't have to follow what they were destined for. It's the person's choice to turn it and make it something good, make their life good. However, there are those people that just don't want to, are still destined for doing evil things, and to only bring harm to others, as well as their selves.
I don't believe people can be destined for evil things unless they have mental issues in which case without outside help, they have no chance of correcting themselves.


  #56  
Old July 26th, 2010, 8:57 pm
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Re: Good and Evil: how do people become either way?

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I don't believe people can be destined for evil things unless they have mental issues in which case without outside help, they have no chance of correcting themselves.
Yes, they have no chance of correcting themselves, and might be born with a mental illness, but it doesn't give them a right to hurt other people without punishment. They are at fault and are in the wrong whether they may physically or mentally hurt a certain individual.


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"We've all got both light and dark inside us.
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That's who we really are." -Sirius Black
  #57  
Old July 27th, 2010, 5:41 am
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Re: Good and Evil: how do people become either way?

Jeffrey Dahmer liked to torture animals when he was a child.

He moved on to torturing people and cannibalization.

Mental or not, he was a vile creature.

His own torture and murder might be seen as either bitter irony or poetic justice. (or both)


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All fighters are pig-headed some way or another: some part of them always thinks they know better than you about something. Truth is: even if they're wrong, even if that one thing is going to be the ruin of them, if you can beat that last bad out of them... they ain't fighters at all.

---Eddie Scrap-Iron Dupris (Million Dollar Baby)

Last edited by Midnightsfire; July 27th, 2010 at 5:43 am.
  #58  
Old July 27th, 2010, 5:42 am
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Re: Good and Evil: how do people become either way?

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Originally Posted by MuggleGirl09 View Post
Yes, they have no chance of correcting themselves, and might be born with a mental illness, but it doesn't give them a right to hurt other people without punishment. They are at fault and are in the wrong whether they may physically or mentally hurt a certain individual.
If someone has a mental or intellectual disability, shoudn't they get treatment rather than punished? I mean, if they're not able to control what they say/do because of this illness, how is punishment going to help?


  #59  
Old July 27th, 2010, 5:45 am
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Re: Good and Evil: how do people become either way?

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I mean, if they're not able to control what they say/do because of this illness, how is punishment going to help?
And this is why some criminals claim insanity. It keeps them out of jail.


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All fighters are pig-headed some way or another: some part of them always thinks they know better than you about something. Truth is: even if they're wrong, even if that one thing is going to be the ruin of them, if you can beat that last bad out of them... they ain't fighters at all.

---Eddie Scrap-Iron Dupris (Million Dollar Baby)
  #60  
Old July 27th, 2010, 5:59 am
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Re: Good and Evil: how do people become either way?

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And this is why some criminals claim insanity. It keeps them out of jail.
Sounds like the problem is with the American legal system then, not those who are mentally challenged. I know there are probably plenty of people who claim insanity when they are anything but, but does that mean that people who do bad things who are genuinely mentally ill should get thrown into gaol with the rest? I don't think so (but then I don't live in the US). Legally speaking, mens rea should cover this anyway. You can't just claim insanity and get away with something.


 
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