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Alfonzo October 13th, 2006 3:08 pm

Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
I'm sure I made a thread about this before, but it seems to have been deleted, so I'll try again...

This thread is about the discussion of the popular anime and manga series Bleach.
The whole series is fairly new (as far as I'm aware), but gaining popularity steadily, with an already large fanbase. Whether you've never seen it before and are curious as to what it's about, or a fan of the series, this thread is for you.

Lets just see where we go from here. Have at it!


NOTE
This is not a thread in which to request manga or anime, nor is it one in which to enquire where you can download either the anime or the manga. COS does not support scanslation or free anime download services, and users who ask where to find these will be punished accordingly.

SSJ_Jup81 October 13th, 2006 4:58 pm

Re: Bleach
 
The series started back in fall of 2004 in Japan, to my knowledge, and is still going. I just recently started watching it. A friend of mine had subbed episodes and gave me the first 16. I actually had episodes downloaded for a friend after it first started, but I never watched it myself, and ended up losing them and never had the opportunity to burn them before the computer died due to the fact that I didn't have any blank cds, and my father wasn't going to let me use his, or the computer in general since he kinda got "control" of that particular one.

Anyway, it's a very interesting series and also intriguing how various series differ in the whole "Death God" type story. Each is told differently. The series Deathnote comes to mind, and as you can see for that, their Shinigami are actually quite gruesome looking; for a series like Bleach, they look like typical humans and aren't immortal or anything like that.

The other thing I like about the series so far is the music. The background themes are pretty good. I wouldn't mind hearing the OSTs released for it so far. I also love that first ending theme, Life is like a Boat by Rie fu. That song is what made me a fan of hers in the first place, even though, at the time I heard the song, I didn't know it was used for Bleach. So, this is a situation where I became a fan of an artist through a song without knowing it was for an anime. No anime exposure for this one. lol

SiriusLoveGirl October 14th, 2006 5:07 am

Re: Bleach
 
I've been watching the dub on Adult Swim, and I really like it. I'd already watched the first episode with subtitles and read about the manga in Shonen Jump, so I decided to watch it. And now I'm a fan.

I love Life is lLike a Boat too! I'm trying to memorize the lyrics. Oh, and ASTERISK is great too.

SSJ_Jup81 October 14th, 2006 6:51 am

Re: Bleach
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by SiriusLoveGirl (Post 4127430)
I've been watching the dub on Adult Swim, and I really like it.

How is the dub in comparison to the original voice acting wise?
Quote:

I love Life is lLike a Boat too! I'm trying to memorize the lyrics.
You know, the lyrics for this song are fairly easy. I learned it by ear, for the most part, because of the way Rie fu pronounces her words, it made it somewhat easy...'cept for when she runs words together and her English is pretty much flawless, imo. I think I've only heard one song by her where the English she used was a bit off.

I like Rie fu so much, I went and bought her first two albums. Too bad ROSE ALBUM, which came out earlier this year, didn't do as well as her first album, Rie fu, which is on my favs list and best purchase I ever made. Sucks I had to order it online from cdjapan (I shoulda tried amazon.jp), but it was worth it. :grin:

Oh, and I've still never listened to Asterisk. I just know it's by ORANGE RANGE (isn't it?), and I haven't kept up with that group since about 2004. I just know they made a killing on Japan's Oricon's Charts last year. Seems practically everything they put out got in the top 10.

Alfonzo October 14th, 2006 9:10 am

Re: Bleach
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by SSJ_Jup81 (Post 4127541)
How is the dub in comparison to the original voice acting wise?

Eh... I didn't like it. Maybe that was because I'd practically watched 97 episodes of the japanese before that though ;). I personally think it is best to try both, to try and find which you like best. Cowboy Bebop, for example, is far better to watch in English dub (imo) than the Japanese...

Quote:

Oh, and I've still never listened to Asterisk. I just know it's by ORANGE RANGE (isn't it?), and I haven't kept up with that group since about 2004. I just know they made a killing on Japan's Oricon's Charts last year. Seems practically everything they put out got in the top 10.
Whatwhatwhat?? It's a brilliant song! If you've watched the first opening sequence then you've heard a condensed version of it; the actual song is a little different, and a lot longer, but still awesome. :D

Tenshi October 14th, 2006 1:00 pm

Re: Bleach
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Alfonzo (Post 4127612)
Eh... I didn't like it. Maybe that was because I'd practically watched 97 episodes of the japanese before that though ;). I personally think it is best to try both, to try and find which you like best. Cowboy Bebop, for example, is far better to watch in English dub (imo) than the Japanese...

:lol: Same here. So nearly all episodes I watched in Original with titles. Dubbed version is so strange, so totally different voices. :shrug:

Ah come on, Uverworld (2nd opening) is soo the best song from whole Bleach. Asterix is also a good one. Oh and "My Pace". This is such a weird song that it's cool at the same time.

I wonder when the Bount arc will end in the Anime. In 10 episodes? In 50? Or will they never go back to the Manga again ...

Alfonzo October 14th, 2006 1:28 pm

Re: Bleach
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TENSHI (Post 4127744)
:lol: Same here. So nearly all episodes I watched in Original with titles. Dubbed version is so strange, so totally different voices. :shrug:

Ah come on, Uverworld (2nd opening) is soo the best song from whole Bleach. Asterix is also a good one. Oh and "My Pace". This is such a weird song that it's cool at the same time.

I wonder when the Bount arc will end in the Anime. In 10 episodes? In 50? Or will they never go back to the Manga again ...

I hate the american voices for the english dub. Blergh.

I totally can't remember the 2nd opening, but I maintain that Asterisk is the best one, so there. :p I hate 'My pace'.

I'm thinking that the bounto arc will end soon. In the latest opening sequnces, we see Gin and Aizen, and also flashes of
Spoiler: show
Ichigo fighting his hollow self
. That makes me think they'll be getting back to the real story soon. About blooming time methinks... :D

Tenshi October 14th, 2006 1:35 pm

Re: Bleach
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Alfonzo (Post 4127763)
I hate the american voices for the english dub. Blergh.

I totally can't remember the 2nd opening, but I maintain that Asterisk is the best one, so there. :p I hate 'My pace'.

I'm thinking that the bounto arc will end soon. In the latest opening sequnces, we see Gin and Aizen, and also flashes of
Spoiler: show
Ichigo fighting his hollow self
. That makes me think they'll be getting back to the real story soon. About blooming time methinks... :D

I don't think you can go after the openings and closings. In the Bount arc opening they showed that Toshiro and Byakuya are in the real world and such things. But this never happend.

The only thing for me that suggests that it will be over soon is that they entered Soul Society and the final battle will be there.

Alfonzo October 14th, 2006 2:20 pm

Re: Bleach
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TENSHI (Post 4127768)
The only thing for me that suggests that it will be over soon is that they entered Soul Society and the final battle will be there.

Well yeah there is that too :).

Alfonzo October 25th, 2006 9:11 pm

Re: Bleach
 
...anybody have any thoughts on Isshin?

Dobby October 26th, 2006 8:23 am

Re: Bleach
 
I think Bleach dubbed is one of the best dubbed anime I've ever seen. I think all of the characters sound perfect (so far from what I can tell). And this is coming from a subbed fan. I'll re-think about the voices once more characters a introduced though (Yoruichi, all the captains and vice captains).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alfonzo (Post 4152163)
...anybody have any thoughts on Isshin?

Manga-wise or anime-wise? Either way, he's different something more than meets the eye.

DarwinMayflower October 26th, 2006 8:39 am

Re: Bleach
 
I find it a bit weird that my Bleach anime thread a while back got closed and yet this one continues to stay open. I could say it's unfair, but whatever life goes on.

Anyways I saw the dub and yes it is pretty much a very well done dub. Far better than Naruto for my tastes. At times it really does seem like it was almost made in North America in the first place. There are some points that are a bit off, but hopefully the voice actors will get a bit better when it get's to the soul society arc.

Alfonzo October 26th, 2006 10:43 am

Re: Bleach
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by DarwinMayflower (Post 4153293)
I find it a bit weird that my Bleach anime thread a while back got closed and yet this one continues to stay open. I could say it's unfair, but whatever life goes on.

The reason that the last thread got closed was because it almost got turned into a place where people where requesting places to download the anime and the manga. COS doesn't support that jazz, so the thread was closed.

Tenshi October 26th, 2006 10:55 am

Re: Bleach
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Alfonzo (Post 4152163)
...anybody have any thoughts on Isshin?

First thought on Isshin: Wow what a violent father. Poor Ichigo and Karin. *pities*

And I still have this thought.

I haven’t read the manga, so I don’t know what will happen there after they left Soul Society again (there were the Bount arc starts in the anime). OK, I know about Isshin and that there's more about him and what that is. But as I haven't read it, I can't say if that would change my opinion of him.

TheRealDJ October 30th, 2006 5:46 am

Re: Bleach
 
Bleach is a fantastic show. Favorite character: Shunsui. He rocks.

Fantasy Moon October 31st, 2006 4:39 am

Re: Bleach
 
I love the manga. Although I'm a little behind since the last volume I purchased was 8 and that was so long ago. Horihime and the flower power!

I've watched episode 1 of the anime, but I didn't really get hooked on it.

DarwinMayflower October 31st, 2006 4:54 am

Re: Bleach
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Fantasy Moon (Post 4157900)
I love the manga. Although I'm a little behind since the last volume I purchased was 8 and that was so long ago. Horihime and the flower power!

I've watched episode 1 of the anime, but I didn't really get hooked on it.

The Bleach Anime does take a bit to getting used to. I watched it first and then read a bit of the Manga. I am quite surprised as to how closely it does follow the manga; almost frame for frame.

Alfonzo January 7th, 2007 6:58 pm

Re: Bleach
 
Alright. The anime filler has ended. Finally it will now begin to go down the same path as the manga ^_^

TheRealDJ January 7th, 2007 9:06 pm

Re: Bleach
 
I do have to say that bleach has done a fantastic job with the fillers. Even though they were still fillers and the main characters didn't gain any new abilities, it was fairly seamless the transition to fillers and back to normal plot. Unlike Naruto where every episode screams filler.

Tenshi January 7th, 2007 9:10 pm

Re: Bleach
 
I just saw today the last episode of the Bount Arc. Can't wait to see the next episodes, when it finally goes back to the old Aizen story (at least I hope it goes back). I didn't like the Bount Arc that much. But I'm fine with anything as long as there appears Toshiro and they use Bankai. :lol:

TheRealDJ January 7th, 2007 9:22 pm

Re: Bleach
 
You know who I really hate though is that lion guy. He just annoys the heck out of me. I'm not sure if he's toshiro or what his name is. But still, he's a very superflous character without any real reason for being there.

_mollywobbles_ January 7th, 2007 9:27 pm

Re: Bleach
 
The title of this thread should be a touch more specific... I came here thinking we were discussing a Fantastic Nirvana Album....

TheRealDJ January 7th, 2007 9:31 pm

Re: Bleach
 
Well hopefully we won't have people come in here talking about how to bleach their hair either. But I'm not sure the title is overly confusing. Atleast not moreso than Fallout Boy, which I commented that I loved that character from Simpsons.

Tenshi January 7th, 2007 9:32 pm

Re: Bleach
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TheRealDJ (Post 4286978)
You know who I really hate though is that lion guy. He just annoys the heck out of me. I'm not sure if he's toshiro or what his name is. But still, he's a very superflous character without any real reason for being there.

Lion guy? You mean the fox or what ever he is. Komamura?

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...x-Komamura.jpg

This is Toshiro Hitsugaya:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...aya.jpg/250px-

Alfonzo January 7th, 2007 9:37 pm

Re: Bleach: the manga and anime.
 
I changed the title.

I quite like Komamura, even more so now that he hasn't got that stupid bucket on his head :D.

Tenshi January 7th, 2007 9:43 pm

Re: Bleach: the manga and anime.
 
To be honest I also find Komamura a bit pointless. Except of first fighting Ichigo and co. and then standing against Aizen, he did nothing. Shuuhei at least went to the real world to help fighting. And other Captains and Vice Captains are doing more as well.

Alfonzo January 7th, 2007 10:09 pm

Re: Bleach: the manga and anime.
 
He was guarding Yamamoto though. I'd like to see him fight properly, as well as Tousen and Gin...

TheRealDJ January 7th, 2007 10:17 pm

Re: Bleach: the manga and anime.
 
Actually I meant the doll that the replacement spirit is in. He has that cross on the back of his head because whats his name sewed him back up. I don't mind Komamura at all though he does seem a bit bland. I preferred him with the kick butt helmet instead. Toshiro is pretty cool. But again, Kyuraka Shunsui is the bomb.

Tenshi January 7th, 2007 10:19 pm

Re: Bleach: the manga and anime.
 
Ahh Kon!

I love Kon. He's so funny and stupid. :rotfl:

Alfonzo January 7th, 2007 10:41 pm

Re: Bleach: the manga and anime.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TENSHI (Post 4287102)
Ahh Kon!

I love Kon. He's so funny and stupid. :rotfl:

Neeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee-san!!!!

Ah, Kyouraku Shunsui. I really want to watch him and Ukitake fight alongside each other properly :D.

Tenshi January 7th, 2007 10:53 pm

Re: Bleach: the manga and anime.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Alfonzo (Post 4287161)
Neeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee-san!!!!

:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:

Neeeee-san!!!

*has her Bleach moment*


Ok, hem *is totally serious now*
Shunsui cracks me up with his lazyness. Poor Nanao-chan who needs to handle him. But as Ukitake and he are the only one with "Twin swords" or what you ever call them, I also would love to see them fight, to see if it's different to normal zanpakutōs.

Dobby January 8th, 2007 5:22 am

Re: Bleach: the manga and anime.
 
I thought the bount arc wasn't bad all. The ending was kind of dissapointing, but whatever. They were heck of a lot better than Naruto ones.

Bleach goes back to manga this Wednesday! Rejoice!

TheRealDJ January 8th, 2007 5:58 am

Re: Bleach: the manga and anime.
 
Argh can't wait to see what the new season of bleach is like. I haven't read the manga so I have no idea. Again Bounto was nice filler, it did what filler was supposed to do and just fill in the lines. Again only annoying things was where they just redid alot of the abilities. What shocked me was the kid captain doing his Bankai since we haven't seen that yet in the series. I mean we saw a brief second of it but then he was nearly killed. Otherwise all his abilities in that fight were new outside of what may've been shown in the manga.

Alfonzo January 8th, 2007 11:40 am

Re: Bleach: the manga and anime.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TheRealDJ (Post 4288142)
Argh can't wait to see what the new season of bleach is like. I haven't read the manga so I have no idea. Again Bounto was nice filler, it did what filler was supposed to do and just fill in the lines. Again only annoying things was where they just redid alot of the abilities. What shocked me was the kid captain doing his Bankai since we haven't seen that yet in the series. I mean we saw a brief second of it but then he was nearly killed. Otherwise all his abilities in that fight were new outside of what may've been shown in the manga.

The Bounto filler was too dragged out, very repetetive and boring. Hitsugaya has used his Bankai several times in the series, including in the Sealed Sword Frenzy OVA. He's also used it several times in the manga so it isn't new.

Tenshi January 8th, 2007 1:15 pm

Re: Bleach: the manga and anime.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dobby (Post 4288092)
I thought the bount arc wasn't bad all. The ending was kind of dissapointing, but whatever. They were heck of a lot better than Naruto ones.

Yes, the ending was very dissappointing. I wished they would have fought till the bitter end or that Kariya would have tried to activate Jōkaishō to recognise that it isn't working.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alfonzo
The Bounto filler was too dragged out, very repetetive and boring. Hitsugaya has used his Bankai several times in the series, including in the Sealed Sword Frenzy OVA. He's also used it several times in the manga so it isn't new.

I think the first time we saw Toshiro using Bankai was during the fight with Gin or not?

Alfonzo January 8th, 2007 5:26 pm

Re: Bleach: the manga and anime.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TENSHI (Post 4288477)
Yes, the ending was very dissappointing. I wished they would have fought till the bitter end or that Kariya would have tried to activate Jōkaishō to recognise that it isn't working.


I think the first time we saw Toshiro using Bankai was during the fight with Gin or not?

Err... I think so. Ichigo killed Kariya far too easily in the end, especially after such a long and bitter battle beforehand. :huh:

TheRealDJ January 8th, 2007 7:50 pm

Re: Bleach: the manga and anime.
 
I have a question: Is Kenchan(Kenpachi) the weakest of the captains? I mean if Ichigo could beat him before being able to go bankai then he has to be pretty easy to beat. Which ofcourse doesn't look good for blindy since he was beaten by kenpachi.

Tenshi January 8th, 2007 8:18 pm

Re: Bleach: the manga and anime.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Alfonzo (Post 4288788)
Err... I think so. Ichigo killed Kariya far too easily in the end, especially after such a long and bitter battle beforehand. :huh:

He killed him? :hmm: I looked for me as if Kariya simply vanished.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheRealDJ (Post 4288989)
I have a question: Is Kenchan(Kenpachi) the weakest of the captains? I mean if Ichigo could beat him before being able to go bankai then he has to be pretty easy to beat. Which ofcourse doesn't look good for blindy since he was beaten by kenpachi.

I don't think that Ken-chan is a easy opponent. The time Ichigo fought him, he turned into his Hollow-self which made him stronger. And Ken-chan even didn't released his zanpakutō.

Furthermore did he defeat Ichinose, who wasn't able to be defeated by various Shinigami.

TheRealDJ January 8th, 2007 8:47 pm

Re: Bleach: the manga and anime.
 
Ichigo didn't turn into his hollow self. He simply was able to use zangetsu properly at that point. Now yes if Ken-chan could release his zanpaktou sure he'd be insanely more powerful, but still at the time of the fight he couldn't. So at that point since Ichigo still wasn't able to go Bankai and would've been beaten by atleast half the captains, does that mean that since he was more powerful than kenchan, that kenchan was one of the less powerful captains?

Tenshi January 8th, 2007 9:15 pm

Re: Bleach: the manga and anime.
 
:hmm: Wasn't there the Hollow mask at around the end of the fight?

TheRealDJ January 8th, 2007 10:12 pm

Re: Bleach: the manga and anime.
 
No...his energy sort of resembled his hollow mask, but Ken-chan also had something like that too. And The girl also had something like that. It was like they were alluding to something only in that one episode and that was it.

Tenshi February 21st, 2007 12:48 am

Re: Bleach: The manga and anime.
 
Thoughts on the new Arc? Anime I mean

I understand the sense of the Arrancar, but the Vizards and their purpose confuse me alot.

But I'm happy that they finally arrived in the real world. It will be a cool arc for sure. :D

TheRealDJ February 21st, 2007 1:10 am

Re: Bleach: The manga and anime.
 
Well we'll have to see who runs the vaizards before we can really decide what they represent. I sort of get the feeling that they were started by Urahara. Since as far as I know he was the only other one to experiment with creating a hollow shinigami combo.

Do you also get the feeling that Aizen may be organizing the Arrancar along the same lines as the shinigami, with a captain class, vice captains and then just low level arrancars?

Tenshi February 21st, 2007 1:19 am

Re: Bleach: The manga and anime.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TheRealDJ (Post 4359034)
Well we'll have to see who runs the vaizards before we can really decide what they represent. I sort of get the feeling that they were started by Urahara. Since as far as I know he was the only other one to experiment with creating a hollow shinigami combo.

Do you also get the feeling that Aizen may be organizing the Arrancar along the same lines as the shinigami, with a captain class, vice captains and then just low level arrancars?

Yeah you're right. But I hope it's not Urahara who's responsible for it. And when he is, then they must be good.

Yes, my thought exactly. When not with vice captains. But a handfull of higher Arrancars like captains who have their own "squads".

TheRealDJ February 21st, 2007 2:33 am

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
well weren't the two that Ichigo fought like mid level arrancar? I think there's one level higher than that which the shinigami said that if Aizen had ten of them on his side, then all of the shinigami might be defeated.

SSJ_Jup81 February 21st, 2007 2:50 am

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
I actually grew bored of the Bounto arc. I don't mind filler arcs, if they change up every once in a while. I get bored of an arc that lasts for many episodes on the same storyline. That's probably why I didn't mind Naruto filler because it was a different arc every so many episodes and why I had a problem with Bleach's filler and DBZ's. The only prob I had with Naruto's filler was the fact that the dynamic was usually the same.

Maybe I'll start back up after the filler. What episode does the arc after the Bounto one start up?

TheRealDJ February 21st, 2007 6:24 am

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
Well what was nice about the bounto arc was that it was actually written by the guy who does the manga. As opposed to the naruto filler with cooking ninja and postmen ninja which I doubt was written by the manga's writer. The bounto arc wrapped up like 3 or 4 episodes ago I think. Not sure the exact number. Wikipedia may have an exact number.

Tenshi February 21st, 2007 10:38 am

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TheRealDJ (Post 4359147)
well weren't the two that Ichigo fought like mid level arrancar? I think there's one level higher than that which the shinigami said that if Aizen had ten of them on his side, then all of the shinigami might be defeated.

From what I understood are those Ichigo were fighting the highest level, because they are "human" like. :shrug:

Quote:

Originally Posted by SSJ_Jup81 (Post 4359173)
Maybe I'll start back up after the filler. What episode does the arc after the Bounto one start up?

List of Bleach episodes

The Arrancar Arc started at # 110. We are currently at 115 at the moment.

SSJ_Jup81 February 21st, 2007 1:08 pm

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TheRealDJ (Post 4359395)
Well what was nice about the bounto arc was that it was actually written by the guy who does the manga. As opposed to the naruto filler with cooking ninja and postmen ninja which I doubt was written by the manga's writer. The bounto arc wrapped up like 3 or 4 episodes ago I think. Not sure the exact number. Wikipedia may have an exact number.

But as I pointed out before, though lame, the Naruto filler arcs (some), I still liked seeing the other characters outside of Naruto. And, as I pointed out, there were a bunch of different filler arcs as opposed to one long one, so there was always some type of a change. That's why I preferred the Naruto filler to Bleach's or DBZ's filler. I didn't really have time to get bored with Naruto's filler since the arcs usually ended before it even got to that point, although, I did skip a couple because I knew it was going to be too Naruto focused.

Alfonzo February 21st, 2007 5:48 pm

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by SSJ_Jup81 (Post 4359580)
But as I pointed out before, though lame, the Naruto filler arcs (some), I still liked seeing the other characters outside of Naruto. And, as I pointed out, there were a bunch of different filler arcs as opposed to one long one, so there was always some type of a change. That's why I preferred the Naruto filler to Bleach's or DBZ's filler. I didn't really have time to get bored with Naruto's filler since the arcs usually ended before it even got to that point, although, I did skip a couple because I knew it was going to be too Naruto focused.

That was the most annoying thing about the Bounto arc - it was far too long. I reckon they could have used at least half the amount of episodes that they used for it. Gosh.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheRealDJ
well weren't the two that Ichigo fought like mid level arrancar? I think there's one level higher than that which the shinigami said that if Aizen had ten of them on his side, then all of the shinigami might be defeated.

Nope. Ulquiorra and Yami are both members of the espada, high level arrancar. Yami obviously isn't as strong as Ulquiorra, but I reckon Ulquiorra could almost beat Urahara, which is a scary thought...

It'll be great when Ichigo can finally control the hollow. :D

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheRealDJ (Post 4289086)
Ichigo didn't turn into his hollow self. He simply was able to use zangetsu properly at that point. Now yes if Ken-chan could release his zanpaktou sure he'd be insanely more powerful, but still at the time of the fight he couldn't. So at that point since Ichigo still wasn't able to go Bankai and would've been beaten by atleast half the captains, does that mean that since he was more powerful than kenchan, that kenchan was one of the less powerful captains?

Not necessarily. I think at that point Ichigo could have beaten other captains. If you think about it, Ichigo was only marginally stronger than Kenpachi in that fight. Also, as Wikipedia tells me, "Even though Kenpachi doesn't know the name of his sword, his spiritual power is so great that his zanpakutō is constantly released. [...] Changed through their battle, Kenpachi begins his search for his zanpakutō's name, so that he can once again challenge Ichigo"

I'd love to see Kenpachi fight Byakuya. Also, do you forsee a fight happening between Isshin and Ryuuken?

TheRealDJ February 21st, 2007 8:11 pm

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
Well with those two I'm pretty sure they were showing their silhouettes when talking about the mid level ones. The high level ones were pretty rare, hence the whole 10 of them would take down all the shinigami. What were they called again? The something lords?

And with Kenpachi I believe you need to know the name of your sword in order to release it. Now if he did release it, he wouldn't be able to seal it again which is what they were talking about. Just like how Ichigo can't do the same with his. I'd also like to see kenpachi fight byakuya too.

I thought the bounto arc was alright in length, though yeah it could've used about 5-8 fewer episodes. The last few dragged it along too much. That and the bounto should've had radically different powers once in the afterlife(blast can't remember the name of the place), instead of just minor upgrades.

Tenshi February 21st, 2007 8:26 pm

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TheRealDJ (Post 4359944)
Well with those two I'm pretty sure they were showing their silhouettes when talking about the mid level ones. The high level ones were pretty rare, hence the whole 10 of them would take down all the shinigami. What were they called again? The something lords?

Vasto Lorde it is. :)

1. Gillians
2. Adjuchas
3. Vasto Lorde

TheRealDJ February 21st, 2007 11:58 pm

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
Evidently according to Wiki, its still unclear if Ulquiorra is a Vasto Lorde or not. Though yes his mask has similarities with the horns of a vasto lorde.

Tenshi February 22nd, 2007 12:03 am

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TheRealDJ (Post 4360290)
Evidently according to Wiki, its still unclear if Ulquiorra is a Vasto Lorde or not. Though yes his mask has similarities with the horns of a vasto lorde.

I see it from this POV:
Toshiro said that Vasto Lorde have so much power, they are able to beat a captain without problems. Ulquiorra is pretty strong, he wasn't impressed by Urahara (who was a captain) and Ichigo. I think that even without "Inner-Hollow-Problems" Ichigo wouldn't be able to defeat him easily.

Alfonzo February 22nd, 2007 12:50 am

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TENSHI (Post 4360301)
I see it from this POV:
Toshiro said that Vasto Lorde have so much power, they are able to beat a captain without problems. Ulquiorra is pretty strong, he wasn't impressed by Urahara (who was a captain) and Ichigo. I think that even without "Inner-Hollow-Problems" Ichigo wouldn't be able to defeat him easily.

Sure. It's worrying that Ulquiorra could deflect one of Urahara's more powerful attacks with just a wave of his hand. I'd say that Urahara was a bit beyond captain class myself, just as I'd say that Byakuya, Soi Fong and Yoruichi are above the skill level of other captains (Kurotsuchi, (or maybe even hitsugaya) for example).

You're right DJ, it isn't clear whether Ulquiorra is Vastro-Lorde based or not...

Wiki is useful isn't it?

...Vasto lorde-class menos (vastorōde) are the most powerful form a menos can take. They take on a much more humanoid appearance and each one is stronger than an average shinigami captain; Tōshirō Hitsugaya claims that ten of them would be enough to defeat all of Soul Society. They are the least common form of menos (Soul Society does not have definite information on the number of vasto lorde) and are believed to only exist within the very depths of Hueco Mundo. It seems that Sōsuke Aizen has important plans with them which haven't been revealed as of yet. Ulquiorra's mask makes the shape of a "Vasto Lorde" mask, but it is still unclear if he is one or not.

An arrancar (sometimes written allankar or arankaru) is a hollow that has removed its mask and gained shinigami powers. The name arrancar is a Spanish verb meaning "to remove" or "to rip off," a reference to an arrancar's removal of its hollow mask.

Few hollows have the potential to remove their hollow masks normally, and even those that can are quite weak. Sōsuke Aizen is able to artifically create arrancar with the Orb of Distortion, which also gives the new arrancar significantly higher power levels.

Arrancar and ordinary hollows differ in two ways: the location of their holes and the almost-total disappearance of their masks. The natural or weaker arrancar have considerably larger portions of their masks intact and usually do not have their hollow holes moved. When hollow become arrancar, the chances of them retaining a humanoid form increase with their intelligence; only vasto lorde-based arrancar will definitely assume a humanoid form. If powerful enough, an arrancar can seal its power in the form of a zanpakutō. Unlike a shinigami, this zanpakutō is by no means sentient. It is simply the hollow's former form sealed into a sword. Therefore, an arrancar's release of their zanpakutō is merely a temporary restoration of the arrancar's true power and form. Arrancar do not have a known second release.

The arrancar under Sōsuke Aizen's command are arranged into various ranks based on their strength. Not all of the existing arrancar are under Aizen's command, mostly through lack of interest on Aizen's part.

The Espada (十刃, Espada? lit. ten swords; sword in Spanish) are the top-ranked arrancar in Aizen's army. Each Espada member is chosen for their superior combat ability and then assigned a number from 1 to 10 that indicates their rank and relative power level, which is tattooed somewhere on their body (Grimmjow's is on his lower back, for instance). The Espada are given control over the Números. Espada are the most powerful fighters of the Menos and their strength far surpasses the average Número, similar to the power gap between the captains and lieutenants in Gotei 13. The Espada consist of nine males and one female.[2]

The Números (Spanish: numbers) are arrancar who were formerly menos. They are assigned a two digit number at birth from 11 to 99 to indicate their age (Número 11 is the oldest, Número 99 is the youngest). They are regarded as combat specialists. The basic Número uniform consists of a white-collared jacket and robes held with a black sash. However, the uniform is customizable, giving each Número a sense of individuality. The fighting ability of Números is thought to be superior to all other arrancar except for the Espada (current and former).

The Privaron (Spanish: deprived) are former Espada who have lost their rank and are assigned a three-digit number. Being former Espada, they are far stronger than the normal Números. They reside in Tres Cifras, which translates literally from Spanish as "three digits". As mentioned by Dordonii, these former 'naturally created' Espada were rendered obsolete after Aizen began artificially creating arrancar to meet his own standards.[3]

The Exequias (Spanish: funeral) are arrancar that are part of the execution division, apparently charged with dealing against intruders/rebels.[4]

TheRealDJ February 22nd, 2007 1:37 am

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
Well with the shinigami captains, it varies greatly. It seems that power is based more on age than on natural abilities. Like for instance the old man is clearly the most powerful of them. And then the two oldest students of his, Shunsui and whats his name are two of the most powerful. Kenpachi sort of seems like raw power aside is fairly weak as a captain, again since he was beaten by ichigo before ichigo was bankai. Byakuya is fairly powerful but still newbesh. Silver haired kid seems fairly powerful too, and probably has one of the greatest potentials as he ages. Yoruichi(the girl with the stinger thing) seems like one of the weakest and is one of the newest captains too. But then again we haven't seen her bankai. Same thing with the tech captain, he's really not all that powerful, but he is augmented by his experiments on himself, and he's a recent addition to replace urahara.

These are just my own observations.

Alfonzo February 22nd, 2007 1:54 am

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TheRealDJ (Post 4360412)
Well with the shinigami captains, it varies greatly. It seems that power is based more on age than on natural abilities. Like for instance the old man is clearly the most powerful of them. And then the two oldest students of his, Shunsui and whats his name are two of the most powerful. Kenpachi sort of seems like raw power aside is fairly weak as a captain, again since he was beaten by ichigo before ichigo was bankai. Byakuya is fairly powerful but still newbesh. Silver haired kid seems fairly powerful too, and probably has one of the greatest potentials as he ages. Yoruichi(the girl with the stinger thing) seems like one of the weakest and is one of the newest captains too. But then again we haven't seen her bankai. Same thing with the tech captain, he's really not all that powerful, but he is augmented by his experiments on himself, and he's a recent addition to replace urahara.

These are just my own observations.

Hm.

Age certainly has something to do with it, but general ability probably counts for more. As well as being the two oldest Captains, Shunsui and Ukitake were both described by Yamamoto as posessing the greatest abilities of all the captains. Also, like Ichigo, the previous lieutenant of Ukitake's squad (I've forgotten his name; he was uncannily like Ichigo) was something of a prodigy, accomplishing in one year what was supposed to take six - becoming very skilled.

It's interesting that we haven't seen Kenpachi using the demon arts at all - I wonder if he has mastered them... What's funny is that his raw power seems to make up for his other weaknesses. This in itself is seemingly his only weakness, but take into account the fact that he is probably stronger than a fair few other captains, not least Komamura and Tousen (who was powerful himself). I doubt Zaraki has found his true power yet.

I find Byakuya problematic. He seemed to be presented as one of the strongest captains, and yet he had a hard time inflicting serious damage on Kariya. In any case, it seems that the margin between him and Ichigo was small, but is getting larger as the series progresses.

It's Soi Fong that has the stinger zanpakutou. She is only slightly weaker than Yoruichi, who is insanely powerful. In my mind, she is one of the more powerful captains. Basically, it seems to me like the strongest characters are: Urahara, Yoruichi, Soi Fong, Ichigo, Byakuya, Rukia (when she gets her powers back - she has an awesome zanpakutou),
Spoiler: show
Isshin
, Shunsui and Ukitake.

spiritedaway February 22nd, 2007 2:56 am

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
It's late and I'm too lazy to read through your posts so I apologize for being off topic of you discussin. But I promise I'll read it all tomorrow and catch up with you all.

I like Bleach both manga and anime, but I'm fan of manga. I skipped last anime filler arc, I was bored and I hate when they aren't following the plot. Heh but now that anime is back on tracks and manga is more interesting than ever, Bleach has my full atantion again.

night to you all

TheRealDJ February 22nd, 2007 3:02 am

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
Well maybe a combination of age and natural ability. They don't really seem to advocate skill at any point in the series. Yeah I agree about byakuya. Its like he's described as the flash step god or whatever, then Shunsui totally owns him with distance in a single flash step. Going what seemed like miles in a single step.
I do think kenpachi can be the most powerful of the captains if he ever actually tried. But unfortunately he (atleast so far) relies too much on his natural abilities. They did insinuate before that Byakuya is more powerful than kenpachi, which makes sense since Ichigo needed bankai. But Kenpachi is more powerful than those other two, beating them handily.
Bleach has a bit of a problem with power leveling, just like DBZ had.

Alfonzo February 22nd, 2007 11:06 am

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TheRealDJ (Post 4360503)
Well maybe a combination of age and natural ability. They don't really seem to advocate skill at any point in the series. Yeah I agree about byakuya. Its like he's described as the flash step god or whatever, then Shunsui totally owns him with distance in a single flash step. Going what seemed like miles in a single step.
I do think kenpachi can be the most powerful of the captains if he ever actually tried. But unfortunately he (atleast so far) relies too much on his natural abilities. They did insinuate before that Byakuya is more powerful than kenpachi, which makes sense since Ichigo needed bankai. But Kenpachi is more powerful than those other two, beating them handily.
Bleach has a bit of a problem with power leveling, just like DBZ had.

No, they do advocate skill - all the time. Ichigo is always having to face opponents with more and more skill, and consequently has to increase in strength each time to protect his friends. It was Yoruichi who was described as the flash step god, being able to outpace Byakuya whilst out of practice and with an unconscious Ichigo over her shoulder. I think it could be a little clearer about the power levelling, yes...

godrics hollow March 2nd, 2007 10:12 pm

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
tehe DJ :P u seem to have a problem with names ;) i personally think byakuya is indeed still one of the most powerful shinigami, and the fact that ichigo beat zaraki without his bankai isnt all that impressive, cause he just used brute force, just like zaraki, he happened to have more of it though.

just like how naruto has more chakra than most, hes useless yet he beats insanely skilled people

what i thought was that yourichi and urahara were passed taichou level and thats why they left... also dont forget about ichigo's dad! i REALLY want to see him get in a serious fight...

as for the latest in the anime! wewt! soo excited the latest episodes just keep getting better one after the other! i wanna see hitsugaya taichou completely murder his guy, while the fat guy drools over matsumoto and then she owns him too :D

what are your guys' thoughts on third seat of zaraki's squad... you think he can do it?

as for the vaizard....
Spoiler: show
the little girl that slaps the guy with her shoe, shes the big shot, she trains ichigo to conquer his hollow side :D

Tenshi March 2nd, 2007 10:18 pm

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by godrics hollow (Post 4374544)
as for the latest in the anime! wewt! soo excited the latest episodes just keep getting better one after the other! i wanna see hitsugaya taichou completely murder his guy, while the fat guy drools over matsumoto and then she owns him too

Really good episode. I wonder how they will be able to defeat all those Arrancar, when they even had problems with only two of them.

godrics hollow March 2nd, 2007 11:12 pm

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
not problems really, if you look at it, the only two who had problems were sado and inoue, both of whom are completely and utterly useless... ichigo completely dismantled the big guy who tried to take em out, (until his hollow side started acting up of course) and we know the ulquiorra (sp?) is very powerful arrancar as he is given so much leway with aizen taichou, or, aizen sama now :P

the only people i see having a problem in their fight are renji, ichigo, and rukia.. albeit ichigo and rukia are fighting the same guy, i think they will have big problems regardless... im quite certain that the rest will be fine..

also these guys are definately not vasto lords, but then why are they normal human size? the second stage Menos are supposed to be hagrid sized no?

Tenshi March 2nd, 2007 11:22 pm

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
Why Renji and Rukia? Renji perfectly masters Bankai. Rukia is not so strong, but she should be able to ... hem... survive at least.

From those they want to attack I rather see the problem at Inoue at this stage and it seems that they are after Tatsuki as well.

They are really no Vasto Lords? Yami and Ulquiorra (who thinks of such names?) too? Yesterday as I watched it I was again sure that they are. Both were shown as they explained the stages again at the moment they mentioned the Vasto Lords.

TheRealDJ March 2nd, 2007 11:48 pm

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
Renji can perform bankai, but he hasn't mastered it. Its that whole 10 years of further training to fully master it. Although for me it seemed that Rukia's fight was way too easy. I mean she lost to a normal hollow before, but now she took out an arrancar with ease.
I am worried about baldy doing alright. As I recall his sword just turns into a spear right? Something not nearly as powerful as say rukia's.
And its believed Ulquoiriaiawhatever might be a vasto lorde. Its not clear whether or not he is according to wiki.

And I still think Flower Captain is only mid level in strength.

Alfonzo March 3rd, 2007 12:13 am

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TheRealDJ (Post 4374732)
Renji can perform bankai, but he hasn't mastered it. Its that whole 10 years of further training to fully master it. Although for me it seemed that Rukia's fight was way too easy. I mean she lost to a normal hollow before, but now she took out an arrancar with ease.
I am worried about baldy doing alright. As I recall his sword just turns into a spear right? Something not nearly as powerful as say rukia's.
And its believed Ulquoiriaiawhatever might be a vasto lorde. Its not clear whether or not he is according to wiki.

And I still think Flower Captain is only mid level in strength.

Renji doesn't seem to be that strong in the anime. As for Rukia, we were told she's strong enough to be a seated officer; in my opinion, she's almost (if not already) at captain class. Her zanpakutou is the most powerful of all the ice and snow type zanpakutous in Soul Society, so it makes sense. Also, don't forget that D-Roy was one of the weakest arrancar.

As for Ikkaku: Major spoiler -
Spoiler: show
He does just fine. Bankai anyone??? ;)


I don't think Ulquiorra is a vastro lorde. I think he's a vastro-lorde based arrancar, but I'm not sure. His mask resembles that of the Exequias.

Tenshi March 3rd, 2007 1:19 am

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
Wait wasn't it Ikkaku who used Bankai on Shuuhei many episodes before without us actually seeing it?

And why is Rukia having the most powerful ice and snow type zanpakutous, isn't it Toshiro who has that?

godrics hollow March 3rd, 2007 2:52 am

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
yes hitsugaya taichou has the most powerful ice type to my knowledge rukias is quote

"The most beautiful snow and ice zhanpaktoh in all of Soul society" (Mod soul used to take rukias body)

anyways i feel renji, because look at how easily the guy deflected his shikai, sure u can say he still has bankai but that guy obviously has way more also

SSJ_Jup81 March 3rd, 2007 3:06 am

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
I so need to get back into watching Bleach. I keep forgetting which ep begins after the Bounto arc, though so that I can catch myself up. Anything dealing with Hitsugaya definitely worth watching. ^^

godrics hollow March 3rd, 2007 3:51 am

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
fillers end around 109? but i will check for u :P gimme 1 sec *checks* yes 109 is the last episode i think it covers a little over how he got rid of the bounto guy (cant remember his name) and then he goes through the portal bak to normal world... so yah have fun!

Alfonzo March 3rd, 2007 10:15 am

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by godrics hollow (Post 4375028)
yes hitsugaya taichou has the most powerful ice type to my knowledge rukias is quote

"The most beautiful snow and ice zhanpaktoh in all of Soul society" (Mod soul used to take rukias body)

anyways i feel renji, because look at how easily the guy deflected his shikai, sure u can say he still has bankai but that guy obviously has way more also

Hm, yeah, whoops. :p

Don't forget about the
Spoiler: show
limit release
:D.

If you haven't read the manga you should really do so.

godrics hollow March 3rd, 2007 5:45 pm

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
NOOO i refuse to read the manga! as much as the suspense is killing me, the anime right now is AMAZING, and so was the shipudden anime at first, then i read the manga, and now the episodes arent so good... so i dont wanna ruin bleach for me..

Alfonzo March 3rd, 2007 5:48 pm

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by godrics hollow (Post 4375903)
NOOO i refuse to read the manga! as much as the suspense is killing me, the anime right now is AMAZING, and so was the shipudden anime at first, then i read the manga, and now the episodes arent so good... so i dont wanna ruin bleach for me..

Nah, it won't ruin it. It hasn't ruined it for me. Plus, you only get to know the full story if you read/watch both - the anime misses some stuff out.

Go on. :evil:

godrics hollow March 3rd, 2007 6:14 pm

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
:P fine just for you... ill read the manga once the anime is over :D hehehe

Alfonzo March 3rd, 2007 6:21 pm

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by godrics hollow (Post 4375933)
:P fine just for you... ill read the manga once the anime is over :D hehehe

What?! The anime won't be over for ages! It's going to take at least another fifteen episodes for it to catch up with the manga. I'm telling you, the manga doesn't spoil watching the anime - believe me, I know! It's just as fun reading the manga as it is watching the anime.

*makes you read it*

godrics hollow March 4th, 2007 6:20 pm

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
NO you can't make me do it! i will resist you!

anyways back ontopic... i have a question about the two guys that joined with aizen taichou, do they show up again ever? this is a yes no answer pplz... if they do don't tell me why :D

Alfonzo March 4th, 2007 6:34 pm

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by godrics hollow (Post 4377448)
NO you can't make me do it! i will resist you!

anyways back ontopic... i have a question about the two guys that joined with aizen taichou, do they show up again ever? this is a yes no answer pplz... if they do don't tell me why :D

Pssh.

Of course Gin and Tousen show up. You'd know about it if you'd read the manga ;).

TheRealDJ March 5th, 2007 12:18 am

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
I like just watching the anime too. The fillers are easier to deal with.

GredandFeorge March 5th, 2007 3:29 am

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
I like both the mange and anime...though the Bounto arc is a bit annoying...apparently Kube did write it though, so it's not as bad as when they make up filler arcs cuz/they're waiting for the manga to catch up...I think that happened with Kare Kano and stuff. I don't know what happened with Naruto - I hated it so I never watched it, but I heard it was on like, a hundred episode filler arc (*snort*).

Anyway, TheRealDJ - love your signature. Laughed out loud...

Kaneha March 5th, 2007 3:31 am

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
Ack, how did I miss a Bleach thread?
I agree about watching the manga & the anime. Aside from filler arcs, you also pick up on different things seeing one still version and one animated one.

For the Naruto episodes, the manga didn't ruin it for me, but perhaps that's because I was so eagerly awaiting it? I mean, it wouldn't have been ruined even if they had done it with popsicle sticks (who gets the reference?)

GredandFeorge March 5th, 2007 3:35 am

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
It was Kare Kano (the popsicle stick reference)...that was the worst episode ever. I don't know how they got away with it...good series though.

But back to Bleach...

I've haven't been able to see past. Ep. 95 for a while - should be able to soon (I know the Bounto filler arc ends soon). Do we ever get to see either Rukia's bankai...?

Kaneha March 5th, 2007 4:31 am

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
(They can get away with it because they're Studio Gainax :rockon: )

We haven't seen Rukia's bankai yet. (At least, not to my knowledge...)

TheRealDJ March 5th, 2007 4:33 am

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
Thanks Gred ;)

The filler is over. there's been about 6 episodes of main plotline. The nice thing about the filler is that they pretty seamlessly integrate the filler stuff into the main plot line.

Alfonzo March 5th, 2007 11:02 am

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TheRealDJ (Post 4378628)
Thanks Gred ;)

The filler is over. there's been about 6 episodes of main plotline. The nice thing about the filler is that they pretty seamlessly integrate the filler stuff into the main plot line.

The bad thing was that it lasted so long!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kaneha
We haven't seen Rukia's bankai yet. (At least, not to my knowledge...)

You're right. We haven't...yet. ;)

MagicianGirl March 5th, 2007 10:26 pm

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
I love Bleach manga and anime (although not as much). The fillers really dragged the series down but now it's back on track especially when they showed the Vaizards. Ulquiorra is awesome.

As for the manga., Kubo has a penchant of surprising his readers and I might say that the last 2 current chapters were really good.

godrics hollow March 6th, 2007 12:31 am

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
we've seen her shikai for sure, which btw is damn sexy... but she obviously has to have a bankai, cause she could've been a taichou but byakuya prevented her from it to protect her

TheRealDJ March 6th, 2007 6:08 am

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
Well its just strange since some people have really powerful shikais and others have really lame ones. Like having your sword turn into a spear? Bah... Lame. Even Renji's isn't that powerful compared to alot of other people's. And he's near captain level.

Alfonzo March 6th, 2007 1:14 pm

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TheRealDJ (Post 4380212)
Well its just strange since some people have really powerful shikais and others have really lame ones. Like having your sword turn into a spear? Bah... Lame. Even Renji's isn't that powerful compared to alot of other people's. And he's near captain level.

Well, it just corresponds to their power level. I think Renji has great potential, but he needs to hone his skill, and master his Bankai too.
Spoiler: show
Don't forget about the limit release though... :D

Tenshi March 6th, 2007 1:42 pm

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TheRealDJ (Post 4380212)
Well its just strange since some people have really powerful shikais and others have really lame ones. Like having your sword turn into a spear? Bah... Lame. Even Renji's isn't that powerful compared to alot of other people's. And he's near captain level.

Like Isshin said. The size and form of a zanpakutou doesn't reflect the power of a shinigami, otherwise some would have to run around with one big as a house. ;)

Some have man high swords and some one a few inch big one and are equally strong.

godrics hollow March 6th, 2007 1:49 pm

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
stop putting spoiler tags its tempting me!!!! renji is technically at taichou level seeing as he's got his bankai... but all the current taichous pwn him so he doesnt have much of a chance

TheRealDJ March 6th, 2007 7:23 pm

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
Yeah but still, when whats his name used his shikai to turn into spear...it was just a small difference than again say Rukia's or even with Renji's Swords. I do think that yes someone can be far more powerful a mere sword would show, but that power extends to all forms of sword. So Spearguy's spear really didn't increase in power.

Alfonzo March 6th, 2007 10:04 pm

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TheRealDJ (Post 4380819)
Yeah but still, when whats his name used his shikai to turn into spear...it was just a small difference than again say Rukia's or even with Renji's Swords. I do think that yes someone can be far more powerful a mere sword would show, but that power extends to all forms of sword. So Spearguy's spear really didn't increase in power.

Shikai does correspond to the power level of the user. So yeah, up until now Ikkaku isn't that powerful, but we have to remember that he's had time to train since Ichigo last beat him. That goes for all of Ichigo's defeated opponents, actually.

Quote:

Originally Posted by godrics hollow
stop putting spoiler tags its tempting me!!!! renji is technically at taichou level seeing as he's got his bankai... but all the current taichous pwn him so he doesnt have much of a chance

Hah. Well you know what'll solve the problem? Read the manga! :D

In some ways I think Renji is at Captain level but also in some ways I don't. He's too hot-headed for one thing, and he still needs to master his Bankai properly.

TheRealDJ March 6th, 2007 11:15 pm

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
Bah its a powerlevel no jutsu problem in bleach. At any other point in the history of the bleach universe, shinigami increase in power slowly over hundreds of years. But only now are people able to become captain level in less than a month... :(

godrics hollow March 7th, 2007 8:42 pm

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TheRealDJ (Post 4381174)
Bah its a powerlevel no jutsu problem in bleach. At any other point in the history of the bleach universe, shinigami increase in power slowly over hundreds of years. But only now are people able to become captain level in less than a month... :(

exactly... it happens all the time...

also we cannot judge ikakkus strength against ichigo, cause well we ALL know that ichigo is over powered beyond anyones dreams... i also think that ikakku just doesnt know the full potential of his shikai, all he sees is a spear and thats all he uses it as (a basic spear that is) there has to be some other bonus in it that he just hasnt uncovered:lol:

Kaneha March 7th, 2007 9:37 pm

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by godrics hollow (Post 4379840)
we've seen her shikai for sure, which btw is damn sexy... but she obviously has to have a bankai, cause she could've been a taichou but byakuya prevented her from it to protect her

Most likely the reason we haven't seen Rukia's bankai yet is because she still doesn't have all of her shinigami powers back. She's recovered most of them though, so hopefully we'll get to see them soon :)

TheRealDJ March 8th, 2007 10:01 am

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
So watching Ikkaku's fight against the arrancar...I have to call it Bull Poop. There's no way he's that powerful in such a short amount of time, or worse that he's always had that power. It goes completely against the fight he had with Ichigo. Its obviously another power level no jutsu problem.

Yeah I just rewatched the fight between Ichigo and Ikkaku and they're completely different. Ikkaku got owned without Ichigo really being at all powerful.

And another issue I have: Why are shinigami suddenly able to walk in mid air? I thought that wasn't possible which is why the flying device was so valuable. But now magically shinigami are able to walkin midair like it was nothing.

Alfonzo March 8th, 2007 10:42 am

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TheRealDJ (Post 4383339)
So watching Ikkaku's fight against the arrancar...I have to call it Bull Poop. There's no way he's that powerful in such a short amount of time, or worse that he's always had that power. It goes completely against the fight he had with Ichigo. Its obviously another power level no jutsu problem.

Yeah I just rewatched the fight between Ichigo and Ikkaku and they're completely different. Ikkaku got owned without Ichigo really being at all powerful.

And another issue I have: Why are shinigami suddenly able to walk in mid air? I thought that wasn't possible which is why the flying device was so valuable. But not magically shinigami are able to walkin midair like it was nothing.

For your first point, think how much Ichigo has changed since his fight with Ikkaku... He gained Bankai, and (in the anime) had that huge Bounto saga - ample time to gain power and skill. He did get stronger, way stronger. By that same logic it would be wrong to say that Ikkaku hadn't had ample time to improve himself; remember, he has Zaraki as his captain - not exactly a weakling trainer...

Dunno about your second point, that's a discrepancy that I've been wondering about myself.

TheRealDJ March 8th, 2007 11:19 am

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Alfonzo (Post 4383361)
For your first point, think how much Ichigo has changed since his fight with Ikkaku... He gained Bankai, and (in the anime) had that huge Bounto saga - ample time to gain power and skill. He did get stronger, way stronger. By that same logic it would be wrong to say that Ikkaku hadn't had ample time to improve himself; remember, he has Zaraki as his captain - not exactly a weakling trainer...

Dunno about your second point, that's a discrepancy that I've been wondering about myself.

Well except that Ichigo is supposed to be a vaizard(or the equivalent of a vaizard) so he's naturally supposed to be far more powerful or be able to grow far more quickly in power.

Tenshi March 8th, 2007 11:25 am

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
Ikkaku also had Ken-chan's disturbing love for fighting. I'm really not fond of his Bankai, from the way it works.

And I got the release of Rukia's. It's not the strongest, but the most beautiful ice-type one. :lol:

About the flying. That's like in Dragonball someone started and a few episodes later all were able to fly for unknown reasons. :rolleyes:

TheRealDJ March 8th, 2007 11:40 am

Re: Bleach: The Manga and Anime
 
Well with dragonball, I sort of just figured it was being able to expel spiritual energy below you, sort of acting as a rocket. So you needed to be at a certain level of power to do it. But yeah it was pretty quick that everyone started flying in DBZ.

But in Bleach they seemed to make it pretty clear that you needed special devices to fly, no matter your power level as a shinigami.


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